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Buc's OL with Zone Blocking

 Wanted to get a couple of quick thoughts jotted down and solicit some opinions.  I'm in the crowd that thinks our OL was coming into their own the last few years.  By spending some good money (Hello Jeff Faine) and using multiple high draft picks (Joseph, Trueblood, Sears, Zuttah) and a bit of a reclamation project (Penn), we put together a young unit that should be able to grow together and develop into an outstanding unit.  Joseph, Trueblood, Sears, and perhaps Faine are big, athletic guys who are maulers.  They want to hit you every play and drive you backwards to open up holes.

This isn't intended to raise doubt, but more to ask questions.  To piggy back off the zone blocking piece that was posted, our new offense, which will utilize the zone blocking scheme, calls for smaller, more athletic guys.  Now, I fully believe that our OL is an athletic bunch.  Can they succeed and make the transition to a new offensive scheme that will play a bit away from their specialty?

The main person I want to point to is Joseph.  He is an absolute animal who will drive you back and get to the second level when called upon.  I truly think he can make the transition, but it might take a few games, or even a year.  I feel a bit disappointed that this OL the Bucs worked and paid to establish, which had formed an identity as a nasty unit (see Trueblood and his 1 personal foul per game average) will be asked to do something different.

If anyone can succeed, its these guys.  They all have high football IQ's, have the acumen to get it done, and are young enough, and athletic enough to take on this new system.

In fact, our OL should be around for years to come.  And the only change I would make (assuming the transition from man to zone blocking goes well) would be to nail down the left tackle spot.  I like what Penn has done, but for the money he wants, I think we can do better.  That, and hopefully Sears is healthy.  Zuttah is a great jack of all trades and will allow us continuity if/when someone goes down.

So what say you Buc 'em nation, how do you feel about our OL and making the transition?

(as an added bonus, for me, hoping this article will shed some light and allow me to part-time/full-time be part of the site).  i'll add a more formal "audition piece' in the near future.

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Doing better than Penn?

The guy has quietly become a Stone wall on the Left Tackle spot.
Name me a DE who has a multiple sack game on him?

It would seem ALL of our linemen are better suited for pass rather than run, but since they are going to be learning this system together (GET IN CAMP PENN) That should help!

I may have to make a movie on our OLine this week! HINT HINT

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by Niko Houllis on Jun 13, 2009 9:45 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

These aren't an exact science

and I havent personally gone and watched the tape and counted but by various posting here are the stats for sacks allowed last year

Penn – 8.5 (16 starts)
Sears – 4.5 (15 starts)
Faine – 1 (16 starts)
Joseph – 1 (12 starts)
Trueblood – 6 (16 starts)

Now, again, those arent an exact science. It doesnt take into count which way a QB rolls, if the sack is a coverage sack etc, but he is heads and tails above the rest, he is 4th worst amongst starting left tackles in the league.

I think Penn could be a very servicable guy, he’s not flashy, he won’t show up alot, but he gets the job done. I think for the money he wants, we could upgrade, but if there is a weak link in our line, I want it to look like him. Most teams would be happy if he was there 3rd best lineman, and he is our “worst” (but still better than we could hope for in previous season).

The other concern on the line is Trueblood. He was a mauler and towards the last half of 2008, he started to revert to some silly habits, both in play and penalty. It was like Kenyatta Walker got ahold of him for the last 3-4 games. Here’s hoping Trueblood can find his first 20 game form from 2007-2008.

by Buc Wild on Jun 13, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

problem with that is the QB on the team last year

ran into most of those sacks.

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by Niko Houllis on Jun 13, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

and like I said, its not an exact stat (sacks allowed), but it at least gives you an idea of where each guy stood compared to others.

The best part of our OL is their intelligence. All of these guys seem like they have the football acumen to pick up and understand a new system.

by Buc Wild on Jun 13, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I like

Our O-line. I hope they don’t get jumbled in the new scheme. They, along with the RB’s, are the one bright spot on our team. It’s not been too long ago that our O-lines sucked year in and year out. Ruining or hampering careers of some good signal callers along the way. See Craig Erickson, Vinny(went on to better things), Steve Young, Steve Deberg. They all got creamed while playing for the Bucs. Who knew Erickson was so broken when he left here that he only took a few more hits and ended his promising career. We need to make this current group work and pay them to stay. Good O-line don’t just happen they gel as a unit.

by SGT MIKE on Jun 13, 2009 10:26 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Excellent Point Sgt Mike!

Well put. Makes you wonder how good some of those guys would have been had they had a complete line in front of them rather than the two good ones and three….well, whatever!
Dont give up on the trivia just cuz I wont be on HERE!!!! :)

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by Niko Houllis on Jun 13, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

THE O-LINE

We have now is probally the best solid unit we ever had. I feel confident they can make a transition to a new scheme of play. They`re young quick and athletic enough surely. Would be nice to find another GRUBER but we should still be able to play a quick smash-mouth football now.

by stixx692001 on Jun 13, 2009 12:31 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I realize Im an old fart and will now prove it to everyone lol

But in 79 we actually had a pretty good line that allowed 9 sacks ALL YEAR (16 games). Of course Doug Williams had something to do with that too, but we also had a 1200 yard rusher, and The 2nd back had 600 more yards. I realize of course that if you lined those guys up today, USC D line would push them around.

BucStop.com a new blog for Bucs Fans <
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by Niko Houllis on Jun 13, 2009 1:47 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I'm not as high on our o-line...

Don’t get me wrong, we have a lot of talented people on our line, but they were all drafted to be in a drive blocking scheme. zone blocking is soooo different and im not sure we have the personnell to pull it off right now. jeff faine is a great pass blocker, but hes not very good at blocking in open space, which we NEED our centers to do. davin joseph is a beast, and word is hes dropped about 20 pounds and looks sweet, so im not worried about him. zuttah is actually a perfect fit for this scheme and is also a very good pass protecter so sears could be a blessing in disguise. i honestly am scared to death of trueblood in this scheme. he has bad and slow feet and often looks like hes playing in sand, and has a huge problem with speed rushers. he should do fine when we run to his side but we might have extreme difficulties running an outside zone to the left, i just cannot see trueblood running downfield to block a linebacker in space. donald penn improved dramatically last season and really shut down some premier rushers, but he seemed to have wore down A LOT at times. hes extremely athletic for a big guy and has the potential to be a great left tackle but the problem is hes got a tire hanging from his midsection and does not appear to be in good shape or want to be the best player he can be. that is a huge concern for this scheme so we can only hope that the reason hes missing OTAs is because hes spending his entire day on the treadmill. ive always been a fan of the zone blocking scheme but i expect growing pains and i think we will have limitations on what we can do. dont expect 150 yards rushing against dallas.

by entrekpk on Jun 14, 2009 6:30 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think our players wore down in General last year, all of them seemed to.

Probably a side effect of Grudens lack of coaching fundamentals and practicing in pads, instead babying older players and constantly installing new plays instead during OTAs.

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by Niko Houllis on Jun 15, 2009 5:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

and bill muir...

i think bill muir was equivalent to tits on a bull. i like what i read about pete mangurian. all of them really need to refine and tune up their mechanics IMO. its like anything, im sure they all could fit this scheme if they really want to work hard at it. it needs to go both ways and thats what scares me about penn, but hopefully everyone is working their butt of with the strength coach kurt shultz on how to get quicker and leaner.

by entrekpk on Jun 15, 2009 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

just on the subject of penn

“we could do better for the money”

he’s down near the bottom of the list in terms of salary for starting LTs. there’s absolutely no way they could upgrade over him for the same amount of money.

by OfficerRodFarva on Jun 16, 2009 10:13 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Not for what we are paying him now

but for what he is asking for, we could definitely upgrade. He wants to be paid towards the top bracket of LT and I dont think he is in that range. If he wants to say in that one year tender range of $2.2MM/year, I’ve got no issue with that at all.

I just think if he wants to be paid like a Pro-Bowler, or like some of the other members of the OL, we cut bait with him, he isn’t worth that kind of money at this point.

by Buc Wild on Jun 17, 2009 8:33 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Do you have a link or source or anything for him wanting pro bowl money? This is the first I’m hearing about anything like that.

I think they absolutely should pay him like a starting LT, but he shouldn’t be asking for pro bowl money without getting to the pro bowl.

by OfficerRodFarva on Jun 17, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Here's a quote

“"My agent and I talked about that," Penn said. "We’re pretty confident that if they do tender me with an offer that another team would come get me. Like I said, the film doesn’t lie. The last two years, I’ve been the lowest-paid starting left tackle in the league. There are no complaints from me about that. I know I worked my way up from the bottom. I’m just going to keep working. I want to be one of the best when it’s all said and done."

To me, that indicates he thinks a team is willing to give up a first and third round pick. I would think if a team gave up a first and third rounder for a player, any player, that big money should and will follow.

Now, obviously, no one offered at him, but that is pretty interesting to me. Maybe I filled in the blanks, but I dont feel we’re far off by extrapolating his contract demands if he and/or his agent believe he is worth a first and third.

by Buc Wild on Jun 17, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think you might be reading a little too deep into that statement, but you do have a point.

Either way though, he IS woefully underpaid compared to every other starting LT in the league. He’s correct to want more money. He’s been solid, and he’s still young, so he’s only going to get better.

by OfficerRodFarva on Jun 17, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

CallMeTaterNuts seems to have the inside track on the Buc'Em Gig!

For starters, he posts! No one else is, consistantly that is.
2) He can handle the pressure, negative comments dont phase him
3) He’s shown he can research the stats needed

Oh, and he used my old videos! LOL -PROPS!!!

BucStop.com a new blog for Bucs Fans <
Where else would you stop for everything Buccaneers?

by Niko Houllis on Jun 18, 2009 11:07 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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